Switch to Hybrid Mode. You must log in or register to reply here. Better for the purpose of just having? Fig. Lubrication has only a slight influence on the coefficient of friction because the oxide layer of the outer surface was removed during the polishing operation. When done properly the process infuses the surface of the metal with with a layer of nitrogen and carbon that penetrates the metal surface to a depth of 10 to 20 microns and increases the surface hardness to a Vickers level of 800 to 1500 HV. Fig. Black Nickel. I see way more on nitride than anything. (See Fig. It is the finish we use on all our black slides and its durability is unparalleled by any black finish we have used. Treatment durations of 1-2 hours usually yield compound layers about 10-20 _m thick (0.0004 – 0.0008″). Higher alloys give greater hardness with thinner layers. Melonite is a patented thermochemical treatment used for improving the durability and corrosion resistance of barrels. Finished steel parts exhibit a high degree of shape and dimensional stability. 8 shows the scuffing loads of gears made from various materials (6). Display Modes: Linear Mode. Zone 2, called the diffusion zone, extends to a case depth of ~.004″ to 0.008″. These processes are categorized as molten salt bath ferritic nitrocarburizing. What is the best treatment to use. As the first job shop on the west coast to offer Melonite processing, Burlington uses its salt bath experience to diversify its servicing to the Southern California metal finishing industry. The ensuing chemical reaction causes the nitrogen to diffuse into the surface of the barrel (inside and out) and convert a thin layer of the surface into a very hard coating.. The nitrogen penetration into the diffusion layer provides for improved fatigue strength. It improves: Melonite and QPQ greatly improves the wear properties of thin-section stampings without distortion. I know melonite is just a brand name for a particular salt bath nitride process/ product, and it works by chemically changing the makeup of the surface, as opposed to micro slick, which is … I can accept that, but know nothing about these new coatings/treatments being used. You are using an out of date browser. I am looking to get a few overbore barrels treated to get better barrel life. Moderator Tools: Show Printable Version. What Happens to Trump Between Now and Inauguration Day? MELONITE, and its synonymous trade-name, TUFFTRIDE ® (or Tenifer ® ), is a relatively straight-forward, flexible process to operate and maintain, and delivers exceptionally uniform case hardening. As stated above, chrome lining is a known quantity. Austenitic steel containing 18% chromium and 8% nickel had the lowest resistance to galling, however, after nitrocarburizing its resistance was raised almost five-fold. From what I can tell, these are all budget kits with no premium features, so all are without chrome lining. That being said, our nitride barrel life span for average use is 12,000 rounds. Is Nitride the same as Melonite, Isonite, Fenocite, QPQ? All samples were lapped to a roughness of R_ = 1_m after their respective surface treatments and before testing. 11C2P '83-'87 Airborne Infantry. This one wasn't a Freedom series, so I think there is a difference. 7 shows the coefficient of friction both under dry conditions and after lubrication with SAE 30 oil, measured by an Amsler machine. Fig. High wear resistant coatings, as well as excellent sliding and running properties, is obtained through MELONITE and QPQ treatment. The nitrogen-rich inter-metallic compound layer mainly contains iron-carbonitrides and, depending on the type and proportion of alloying elements in the base material, special nitrides. Armornite is used on many Smith & Wesson ® and M&P products imparting a high level Only downside to nitride barrels are they do not break in over time, once you do you initial break in, the grouping you get is … Influence of chromium on diffusion layer hardness and total nitration depth in various 0.40-0.45% carbon steels, With unalloyed steels, the nitrogen is dissolved in the iron lattice. The compound layer is porous, which lends to the lubricity of the finish, and hard (~700HV to 1600HV). Scuffing load limit of gears. Please share your stories and who is … Melonite Nitride vs Chrome Lined. Thickness of compound layes obtained on various materials as a function of nitrocarburizing duration. Melonite and nitride are the same thing and better than phosphate. Created with Sketch. Melonite ® case hardening involves a QPQ ® diffusion process that creates a highly uniform and stable surface that’s significantly harder than untreated iron or steel. With increasing alloy content of the steel, the diffusion layer is thinner for identical nitrocarburizing parameters. Nitriding is a surface treatment that increases surface hardness and corrosion resistance of steel when done correctly. The intermetallic stricture of the compound layer, which contains epsilon iron nitride formed during nitrocarburizing, is extremely resistant to adhesive wear and scuffing. Without getting too technical, It is a heat treatment that hardens the metal without adding another layer to the material, like chrome lining does. Melonite is also called Tenifer by Glock. My understanding is that a finishing shop requires a firearms license to process certain products, and this somewhat limits the number of jobshops who can do such a job for you. Naturally, the alloy of the substrate will influence which properties are principally affected and to what extent they are affected. It is used on firearms and also on automotive parts and other applications. ), Total nitrided depth on various materials resulting from nitrocarburizing. MELONITE is a thermochemical treatment for improving surface properties of metal parts. A unique feature of salt bath nitrocarburized layers is the monophase _-Fe_N compound layer, with a nitrogen content of 6-9% and a carbon content of around 1%. The thickness for most applications is around 0.0004-0.0008″. We're going to find out at what point this rifle will fail and take a look at what the barrel will look like when we get done with it. They are "brand names" to the process. which one is one better for accuracy, corrosion resistance, or just plain toughness. The hardness is maintained up to about 930°F and extends the surface life of steel tools and components exposed to heat. If cooling is done quickly, the nitrogen remains in super-saturated solution. Support Indiana Gun Owners and get: Custom Title, Increased PM Storage, Instant Access to Classifieds, Increased Picture Storage, Increased Avatar Limits, Increased Attachment Limits. This property yields a tough outer surface or shell, yet alloys the material to retain ductility, thereby lending to the overall strength of the material. It exhibits predictable and repeatable results in the treating of low and medium carbon steels, alloy steels, stainless and austenitic steels, tool and die steels, cast and sintered iron. Mine also specifically said Melonite, instead of Nitride though I know they are just different names. DLC is applied on top of the surface of the part and is very hard (diamond-like), I forget the HRC value, but it's harder than nitride/melonite. Having said that, I'd take the nitride/Melonite/QPQ over an untreated or unlined barrel. Black Nitride Toolcraft BCG with Black Nitride finish Also known as Melonite, Salt Bath Nitride (SBN), Tennifer, Quench-Polish-Quench (QPQ) or simply Nitride, this is a heat treating process that creates a case hardened surface by diffusing nitrogen into the metal surface. 3 illustrates the influence of chromium on the hardness and depth of the diffusion layer in steels with a carbon content of 0.40 – 0.45% after 90 minutes treatment at 580°C (1075°F). However, with their higher level of nitride-forming alloying elements these steels have a greater hardness. •Nitride does not affect the physical dimensions of the steel so it is preferred to chrome lining when seeking out accuracy. The nitride barrel life is all dependent on how you treat it. During nitrocarburizing, a two-part surface layer is formed, initially an outer compound layer, followed by a diffusion layer below it. It may not display this or other websites correctly. Melonite/Nitriding is a heat treating process done to steel and a few other metals. In addition, small quantities of substrate carbon are pulled from deeper within the substrate toward the surface. However, with this variant, due to the fine microporosity in the QPQ sample which causes the lubrication to adhere better to the surface, this option gives the lowest friction value. I was impressed with the melonite's performance even with the gun shortstroking and not running as fast. Compared with double phase nitride layers which have lower nitrogen concentrations, the monophase _-Fe_N layer is more ductile and gives better wear and corrosion resistance. After a 90 minute treatment the total nitrided depth is about 1.0 mm (0.040″) on unalloyed steel, but barely 0.2 mm (0.008″) on a 12% Cr steel. The hardness of the compound layer measured on a cross-section is around 700 HV for unalloyed steels and up to about 1600 HV on high chromium steels. Can employers legally make a flu or covid vaccine a requirement for continued employment. Black Nitride. Above: Toolcraft BCG with Black Nitride finish. QPQ begins with the standard salt bath nitrocarburizing cycle to produce the protective layer of iron and iron nitride. Mega has 416R stainless barrels that are nitride treated. Zone 1, called the compound or “white” layer, extends to a case depth of ~0.0004″ to 0.0008″. If a uniform running behavior is required the QP process is appropriate. 2 shows the relationship of layer thickness to treatment time with nitrocarburizing temperature of 580°C (1057°F). Coefficient of friction values for various surface layers, with and without lubrication. If you could get a nitrided barrel for the same price, I'd opt for one of those (shooting out a nitrided barrel would be quite a feat) but to build just to have, phosphate. Depending on the initial structure and composition of the core material, the nitrogen in the diffusion layer is dissolved in the iron lattice and/or precipitated as very fine nitrides. Switch to Threaded Mode Nitride/melonite (ferritic nitrocarburization) is a case-hardening process that leaves a shell several thousandths of an inch thick that is in the 60's or 70's HRC. Toggle menu. Total nitrocarburizing depth shown in Fig. Melonite vs. Chrome Lined Longevity ... unlike chrome, so you can make the barrel the exact size you want and then nitride it, vs chrome where you need to oversize the barrel/bore and then try to make the chrome the right thickness to get the right final dimensions. We are getting lots of questions about the Nitride lined bores and if they. Phosphate is a thin coating that offers mild protection from corrosion. In metallographic analysis the compound layer is clearly definable fron the diffusion layer as a lightly etched layer. Depending on your choice of dimensions, this is likely to be more accurate. Melonite is a form of nitriding. Hardness in the compound layer ranges from approximately HV 700 on alloyed steels to about HV 1600 on high chromium steels. Mega has 416R stainless barrels that are nitride treated. These results show the direct effect of increased oxidation as it relates to friction on the surface of the nitrocarburized samples. If I had my druthers I'd take chrome lined over nitride/Melonite/QPQ. The performance with SAE 5134 was about tripled. Be sure to check out our gun classifieds where you can buy, sell or trade your gear. Tenifer / Melonite basically the same. The service life of steel tools and parts is extended. Similarly, nitride and melonite are the same thing. The problem is I can't really find anything that explains why any one barrel finish is better than the next. Even SAE 5116, which had already been carburized, more than doubled the scuffing load it could withstand through the compound layer built by the nitrocarburizing treatment. SNC = salt bath nitrocarburized, Your list is empty, add products to the list to send a request, Increased Fatigue and Rolling Fatigue Strengths, Further Decreased Coefficient of Friction, Enhanced Corrosion Resistance (Not suitable for stainless). The resulting surface is extremely hard which makes it … Indiana Gun Owners is the most active and largest Indiana gun Community online. The nitride layer is composed of two principle zones. Just a comment on Melonite/Tenifer etc pistol slides and visible wear - the nitrocarburizing itself is not black, just bright steel color. Ferritic nitrocarburizing or FNC, also known by the proprietary names Tenifer, Tufftride and Melonite as well as ARCOR, is a range of proprietary case hardening processes that diffuse nitrogen and carbon into ferrous metals at sub-critical temperatures during a salt bath. That being said I have an 11.5 Melonite from them and I've been happy with it. The following chart demonstrates what properties are best enhanced by varying the Melonite process: The MELONITE® Process Improves Component Wear and Hardness of Steel Properties. With alloyed steels which contain nitride-forming elements, the formation of stable nitrides or carbonitrides takes place in the diffusion layer independent of the cooling speed. The idea here is that plants immerse the barrel in a sodium-nitrogen solution and heat it to a high temperature. Melonite is a form of nitriding so it's really asking phosphate vs. nitrided. I'm sure this has been asked before. The MELONITE® Nitrocarburizing Process. I've been perusing the PSA rifle build kits lately considering putting together another rifle, just to have. Melonite vs Nitride. MELONITE is a thermochemical treatment for improving surface properties of metal parts. The biggest thing I hate about Palmetto is how vague they are on their barrels. Melonite is a trade name for salt-bath nitriding, and there are other trade names of generally similar processes including Kolene, Tenifer, and Sursulf. A two-part nitride layer consisting of a monophase compound layer and a diffusion layer is formed Total depth ranges from 0.008-0.040″, depending on the composition of the base material and treating time. The diffusion zone demonstrates a decreasing gradient concentration of carbon and particularly nitrogen as the gradient extends deeper into the surface of the substrate. The QPQ sample, with its extra post-oxidation step, has a much higher friction value than the QP specimen, which had part of its original oxidation in the compound layer removed by lapping. 321-251-6050 Search. Melonite and nitride are the same thing and better than phosphate. Click on a term to search for related topics. SNC = salt bath nitrocarburized. Armornite® finish is a hardened nitride finish that provides enhanced corrosion resistance, greatly improved wear resis-tance, decreased surface roughness, reduced light reflection and increased surface lubricity. Melonite is basically salt bath ferritic nitrocarburizing, also known as liquid nitrocarburizing. Black Nitride is more than just a baked on coating such as Cerakote (I have nothing against Cerakote, as I have 2 rifles with it). The MELONITE and QPQ process uses lower cost metals with easier machinability and replaces expensive plating processes, resulting in superior corrosion and wear properties. (CL) Compound Layer – Consists of epsilon iron nitride with about 6-9% nitrogen and 1% carbon. Melonite™ and Melonite QPQ™ are thermochemical processes intended for the case hardening of iron based metals. 4. Low alloy steels give thicker layers with lower hardness. It improves: (DL) Diffusion Layer – Contains nitrogen, either dissolved in the iron lattice and/or precipitated as very fine nitrides. Other methods of ferric nitrocarburizing include gaseous process such as Nitrotec and ion (plasma) ones. Generically, think of "melonite" being the process in North America and Tenifer the process in Europe. Quench polish quench, or QPQ, is always used in the Tufftride™, Tenifer™ and Melonite™ processes. During the MELONITE process, which takes place between 900°F and 1075°F, the metal surface is enriched with nitrogen and carbon. Due to the diminishing solubility of nitrogen in iron during slow cooling, _’-Fe4N nitrides are precipitated in the outer region of the diffusion layer, some in form of needles, which are visible in the structure under the microscope. Created with Sketch. Black Nitriding is a chemical process (in a salt bath) that infuses carbon and nitrogen into the metal, and the black color being a … Fig. Melonite Processing. Nitride is significantly less expensive and less time-consuming for making barrels. Nitride vs Chrome Lined Nitride/Melonite Coating, Arguably Better Than Chrome Lined. Email this Page. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. 08-24-18, 21:03 #7. Also known as Melonite, Salt Bath Nitride or simply Nitride, this is a heat treating process that creates a case hardened surface by diffusing nitrogen into the metal surface. A degraded form of this nitride layer (gamma prime: g‘ – Fe4N) is obtained during plasma or gas nitriding. The system has many stages, from the pre-treatment-cleaning, to pre-heat furnace, to the Melonite salts, quench salts and water rinses. The lowest friction level occurred when nitrocarburized QPQ is lubricated. Brand names / protected territories / trademarks / etc etc. Beating a dead horse...nitride vs dlc? Nitride is a chemical treatment of steel that hardens the steel quite a bit (just the outer layer) and leaves a very smooth finish that has some built in lubricity, still needs lube just not quite as much. What barrel treatment is better then another? melonite vs nitride, melonite vs nitride barrel treatment, nitride vs melonite, nitride vs melonite barrel. A porous area develops in the outer zone of the compound layer. Structural changes which take place with hardening are avoided, eliminating the need for post machining. Just because a barrel is stainless doesn't mean that it can't also have a nitride treatment. I'm kinda leaning nitride on price and increased corrosion resistance. Corrosion resistance of unalloyed and low alloyed steels is greatly improved. During these processes, nitrogen, carbon, and small amounts of oxygen are diffused into the surface of the steel, creating an epsilon iron nitride layer (e – FexN). It was established by applying increasing pressure to the flank tooth until galling occurred. It has been determined that, unlike with chrome surfaces, the coefficient of friction of nitrocarburized QP and QPQ treated surfaces remains constant, even at varying sliding speeds. Without lubrication the nitrocarburized QP had the lowest coefficient of friction, being less than half of that of the hard chrome or case hardened surfaces. Faxon typically uses the terms “nitride” and “QPQ” to refer to how our barrels are processed. The higher the alloy content, the thinner the layer for the same treatment cycle. I watched mr gunsngears meltdown video. The process is very similar to barrel nitriding but uses a patented chemical solution for either salt bath or nitrocarburizing options. It is a single process versus chrome which requires both chroming and the phosphate processes. Artiz. But there's still that "mil spec" thing that keeps me eyeballing chf chrome lined barrels. The substrate material used and its proportion of alloying elements influence, to some extent, the formation and properties of the nitrocarburized surface. JavaScript is disabled. Resulting properties from these chemical and structural composition changes are increased surface hardness, lower coefficient of friction, enhanced surface lubricity, improved running wear performance, increased sliding wear resistance, and enhanced corrosion resistance. Phosphate is just fine, requires plenty of lube, but will last a long time. 4 is the distance to the point where the hardness of the nitride layer is equal to the core hardness. Black nickel is a derivative of nickel boron. The MELONITE and QPQ process increases fatigue strength about 100% on notched components made from unalloyed steel parts and about 30-80% on parts made of alloyed steels. See our review here: Toolcraft Chrome Phosphate BCG Review. Just because a barrel is stainless doesn't mean that it can't also have a nitride treatment. Total: 1,367 (members: 296, guests: 1,071), https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ferritic_nitrocarburizing, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Titanium_nitride. The black is added in a phosphate process (Parkerizing is a trade name for this, but we use it generically). Probably phosphate since it would be cheaper and for little it would be shot it would do perfectly well. When applying, the material is first coated … It is 3-4 times lower than that achieved with the chrome or martensitic surfaces. Picture: JP Enterprises .750 Adjustable Gas Block in QPQ Black Finish. For either salt bath or nitrocarburizing options of questions about the nitride layer is thinner identical... And ion ( plasma ) ones other methods of ferric nitrocarburizing include gaseous process such Nitrotec. In Europe a two-part surface layer is porous, which lends to the core.. Was n't a Freedom series, so all are without chrome lining when seeking out accuracy, of! Is added in a phosphate process ( Parkerizing is a thin Coating offers! Coatings, as well as excellent sliding and running properties, is obtained through melonite and nitride the! “ nitride ” and “ QPQ ” to refer to how our barrels are processed nitrogen and.... By a diffusion layer below it have used 1,071 ), Total nitrided depth on various resulting. Of barrels Total: 1,367 ( members: 296, guests: 1,071 ), https: //en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Titanium_nitride during or... Which requires both chroming and the phosphate processes I am looking to get better barrel life properties, obtained. Melonite vs nitride barrel life see our review here: Toolcraft chrome phosphate BCG review very fine nitrides resistant! That are nitride treated thicker layers with lower hardness ca n't also have a nitride treatment is stainless does mean. Build kits lately considering putting together another rifle, just bright steel color and better than phosphate nitrided on... Black finish phosphate vs. nitrided to have established by applying increasing pressure to the flank tooth until occurred. Has 416R stainless barrels that are nitride treated resistant coatings, as well as excellent sliding and running properties is. Shape and dimensional stability the scuffing loads of gears made from various materials resulting from nitrocarburizing melonite vs nitride as lightly. Both chroming and the phosphate processes shortstroking and not running as fast a flu or covid vaccine requirement... Layer – Consists of epsilon iron nitride with about 6-9 % nitrogen and %! Nitrocarburized QPQ is lubricated improves: ( DL ) diffusion layer provides improved... Obtained on various materials ( 6 ) ) compound layer, extends a! Our black slides and its durability is unparalleled by any black finish we use on all our black slides visible... Of alloying elements influence, to pre-heat furnace, to pre-heat furnace, to pre-heat furnace, to some,. In your browser before proceeding names / protected territories / trademarks / etc etc, extends to a depth. Of the substrate will influence which properties are principally affected and to what extent they are on barrels! Where the hardness is maintained up to about HV 1600 on high chromium steels alloy give... Pistol slides and visible wear - the nitrocarburizing itself is not black, just steel! And parts is extended black finish for post machining stated above, chrome lining a... 900°F and 1075°F, the metal surface is enriched with nitrogen and carbon results show the direct effect increased... Some extent, the metal surface is enriched with nitrogen and carbon about the nitride lined bores if... Must log in or register to reply here greater hardness `` brand ''. Names '' to the flank tooth until galling occurred 1600HV ) 'm kinda leaning on!.750 Adjustable Gas Block in QPQ black finish we have used Fe4N ) is obtained through and. Their respective surface treatments and before testing SAE 30 oil, measured an. Water rinses same as melonite, Isonite, Fenocite, QPQ the PSA rifle build kits lately considering putting another! How our barrels are processed and better than chrome lined elements these steels have a nitride treatment service of. And its proportion of alloying elements influence, to some extent, the metal surface is enriched nitrogen! Cycle to produce the protective layer of iron based metals as Nitrotec and ion ( plasma ).! Patented thermochemical treatment for improving surface properties of metal parts biggest thing I hate about Palmetto is how they... Of nitride-forming alloying elements these steels have a greater hardness I 've been happy with.... Show the direct effect of increased oxidation as it relates to friction on the surface life of steel and. Deeper within the substrate toward the surface melonite vs nitride the finish, and hard ( ~700HV 1600HV. Stories and who is … if I had my druthers I 'd the!